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love_lolita
04-01-2010, 12:02 PM
Nurse Rozetta (Alice Cooper): I just cant sleep at night/ Rozetta dressed in white

HSG: When i was cutting/ she was dressed in white

yeah, little details. but listen to the songs.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GoG5zIP-BGA


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rvf1DMDTosk

timoldbean
04-01-2010, 01:03 PM
Nice link! Has never crossed my mind before.

It's a vague one, granted, but a nice link between the two. Rozetta's more of lust and HSG seems to be more love - despite the blatant sex scenes, they do share that sort of 'if i do, it'll be the end of me'.

Fifteen
04-01-2010, 01:28 PM
I like both artists and both song. But no matter how I would love to connect them, I don't think you have a connection here.
Cooper's song is about him (or his persona) being in a madhouse falling in love with a nurse and you see, nurses are usually dressed in white. So I think in Alice's song it's just a logical sentence in which 'white' rhymes on 'night'. While in Manson's song, it might be something symbolic. Probably symbolic for innocence or placing the 'she-person' in an angelic position.
Yes, Manson might know the song. But, no, I don't think he put 'when I was cutting she was dressed in white' in there because of 'I just can't sleep at night, Rozetta dressed in white'. But then again, nobody of us can be sure about those things because we can't really look into anyone's head.

love_lolita
04-01-2010, 01:49 PM
Rozetta's more of lust and HSG seems to be more love - despite the blatant sex scenes, they do share that sort of 'if i do, it'll be the end of me'.

Well, i do feel that HSG is a lust-filled song. the video isnt exactly of a wedding, and smiles, is it? its full on sex-scenes, blood falling from the ceiling, etc. It is a love song, yes. But also very lust-filled. Not as extreme as Nurse Rozetta though.


Yes, Manson might know the song. But, no, I don't think he put 'when I was cutting she was dressed in white' in there because of 'I just can't sleep at night, Rozetta dressed in white'. But then again, nobody of us can be sure about those things because we can't really look into anyone's head.

He didn't put it in the song "because of" someone's line. thats call plagiarism. Its called an influence. As in, maybe he is viewing Evan the same way as Cooper is seeing Nurse Rozetta. one can argue that both of them are seen as being "angelic" because of the "dressed in white". Rozetta in a literal and an ironic sense, since he calls her eyes the "eyes of sin", etc. Evan in more of an innocent, angelic way. It's comparing state of mind, in a way.

VelvetAIDS
04-01-2010, 02:06 PM
Stranger things have happened. You never know.

love_lolita
04-01-2010, 02:08 PM
Stranger things have happened. You never know.

well, if people can believe a connection because of songs having ONE WORD in common, i think that something like this shouldnt just be shit on, you know?

timoldbean
04-01-2010, 02:47 PM
As fifteen points out, she's a nurse ... gonna be dressed in white anyway, which is right and true enough. But I think there's something more than putting it in than just for the sake of rhyme ...this character is noticing an irony of how she is dressed, of a sorts of angelic girl that's supposed to be there to heal him is gonna be the one that might just ruin him... ('she popped the buckle off my bible belt'), being that this guy is deeply religious... maybe to such an extent that he's gone insane (not Alice personally, just from what the lyrics show right from the start ... shepherd, got my scriptures and my wires crossed etc. throughout)

Whether that's got much similarity to HSG.. it's a weak connection, but something none the less. Maybe more of a parallel as they (as in the white references) could both be there easily without knowing of each others' existence.

Manson's a bit harder to be clear about these songs, which gives them well open to interpretation... whilst Alice tells the story clearly.

Manson can be a bit more in a fog - as is the case here (for me at least.)

timoldbean
04-01-2010, 03:37 PM
Well, i do feel that HSG is a lust-filled song. the video isnt exactly of a wedding, and smiles, is it? its full on sex-scenes, blood falling from the ceiling, etc. It is a love song, yes. But also very lust-filled. Not as extreme as Nurse Rozetta though.

OK. Lust filled ... perhaps a different sort of lust? All 'Alice' (or whoever it is) wants from Rozetta, if it wern't such a sin, is to have a good screw. With Manson in HSG, it's more lasting - more urgent than the 'You're devlishly hot, I want sex' but perhaps a lust for something deeper? It's certainly a warning ... don't break my heart or I'll break your heart shaped glasses. There's more at steak when compared with Alice (even on a weak parallel between the two songs), who's lust vulgers him and wants to get rid of it - Manson fully embraces it.

But also, the lust is only that blatant in the HSG video. If the song itself had nothing like that, and we only had the song as it is on the album (much like what we have with rozetta), is that lust as blatant?

S.D.
04-02-2010, 12:30 PM
I read all the responses here, and I can understand people's reactions in both respects. The way I like to look at things is this: We have no idea if something Marilyn Manson says or does is definitely influenced by another cultural event unless he implicitly says so, or unless it's just really fucking obvious. It's really fucking obvious that the death of President Kennedy was an influence on Holy Wood's aesthetic/theme, as it is obvious that Manson used the metaphor of the pupae transforming into a moth/butterfly for Antichrist Superstar, and that the death of David Gunn was the inspiration behind the song featuring his name, etc....
We know those things, so they are seen as commonplace facts, but then come the grey areas, the parts we notice because we are looking, but cannot "prove" were incidental, or intentional, in either case.

With this Alice Cooper comparison, it's likely happenstance that there is a lyric in each song that is similar, but that doesn't make it any less interesting. I'm pretty certain that Marilyn Manson didn't plan to be born in 1969, on 1/5, but he's used the fact that he was entirely to his own artistic advantage (alongside a multitude of other things), and I rather think observing the way events or ideas can correlate in that manner is a positive approach towards art, mostly in order to get more out of it.
Of course there are limits, but I think in this case, considering that Rudy Coby's "Robot" Evan Rachel Wood was decapitated onstage during Heart-Shaped Glasses in a similar manner to Alice Cooper's theatrics, and the fact that Robot Evan was version 3.0 of Nikki Terminator - who wears a nurse's uniform - you can at least draw some satisfying aesthetic conclusions. Interesting reading, thank you for the thoughts.

love_lolita
04-03-2010, 10:47 AM
Thank you, S.D.

S.D.
06-15-2012, 03:30 AM
It occurred to me yesterday, listening to School's Out by Alice Cooper, that the loveable wordplay Alice uses to describe personality traits via language specific to academia was appropriated by Manson very early in his career also.

Alice says "We ain't got no class, we ain't got no principles" during School's Out, obviously playing on a school 'Class', and the American 'Principal' of a school.
Manson did something very similar with The Spooky Kids on No Class (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cJ7d79lkoUE). Speaks for itself really, but "You're like a day outta school; no class" denotes a detrimental social standing or personality, using the 'Class' pun once again.

AssetReign
06-15-2012, 06:41 AM
Puns and wordplay are nothing new in music, nor is one artist emulating and borrowing from another. There will always be parallels to be found, going back to Elvis, who was (rightfully so) accused of appropriating the styling of black musicians of his day and locale.