PDA

View Full Version : The Death Penalty.



Golden Eel
09-15-2011, 08:56 PM
Are you a proponent or not?

Why?

WARNING: OPINIONS BELOW.

Personally, I think it is barbaric and cruel. I think when you sentence someone to die, you're just as 'evil' the person being sentenced. 'Eye for an eye' is outdated, uncivilized bullshit. If someone commits a horrid crime, they should have to spend the remainder of their life locked in a box. But to have government sanctioned extermination seems like a step backwards on the path of building a civilized society.

It doesn't deter anything, either. If someone is going to commit murder, they're doing it for any of three reasons - profit, compulsion, or passion. With passion, there is no thought during the process. They kill because of emotional harm done to them. With compulsion, they kill because they feel they need to because there is a psychological element to the person, forcing them to have those urges and act on them. With profit, the killer has thought out all the circumstances and still kills knowing what may happen to them. I don't think it deters anything at all.

I feel that a government or court has no right to judge whether a human deserves to live or die. There have been many cases of people executed who were later proven to be innocent. Is it worth it to kill one innocent man while also killing hundreds of guilty men?

I think if you agree with the death penalty, then you deserve to be labeled as a murderer yourself.

Also, what about the cost? The cost of Death Row is much higher than the cost of life without parole. So we're (USA) paying much extra to murder people than we would be to keep them locked in cages.

Anyways, discuss.

ThreeEyedGod
09-15-2011, 09:25 PM
Let's just kill everyone and let your god sort them out

iggy
09-15-2011, 09:34 PM
The only problem I have with the death penalty is that like you mentioned, sometimes new evidence comes to light that proves a person's innocence.

I'm also pretty interested to know where you got the information that execution is more expensive...

Golden Eel
09-15-2011, 09:54 PM
I'm also pretty interested to know where you got the information that execution is more expensive...

http://www.deathpenalty.org/article.php?id=42

http://www.deathpenaltyinfo.org/costs-death-penalty

http://deathpenalty.procon.org/view.answers.php?questionID=001000

iggy
09-15-2011, 10:05 PM
That's actually incredibly fascinating! You'd think it would be quite the opposite!

Barbarella
09-15-2011, 11:41 PM
Totally AGAINST.

I have exactly the same opinion as MMT. It is totally barbaric and he has argued his point extremely well so there's no point in me coming in here repeating what he's already said.

I can totally see where a person has lost someone close to them and they feel angry, betrayed and hurt and they might want the culprit(s) executed but I'd wager a high percentage don't actually feel any sense of comfort or even justice from it.



The only problem I have with the death penalty is that like you mentioned, sometimes new evidence comes to light that proves a person's innocence.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-asia-pacific-14895747

A very recent case in point. Not to mention the WM3.

Also in the UK over the last forty years, we have had a good number of cases of miscarriages of justice where, if the Death Penalty had been in place, many innocent people would have needlessly lost their lives.

ShelfLife
09-16-2011, 03:00 AM
I personally find that condemming a person to a windowless box for the remainder of their natural life to be far more barabaric and cruel than simply putting them to death. I'm in favour of the death penalty so long as it's done quickly, cleanly, and with minimum pain. I see it not so much as a punishment, more of a "You're out" maneuver.

And I don't believe in the death penalty for every murderer in the world. But for someone as fucked up as, say, Jeffery Dahmer, the only thing you can do is evict them from this world.

S.D.
09-16-2011, 04:32 AM
I'm glad you submitted this discussion here MMT, resigning something so complex to a Facebook status seems a waste of good debate to me. I did move it over to Art & Philosophies though, I hope you don't mind, it seemed more appropriate as an ideological topic.

Am I in favour of the Death Penalty? No. Why? Well, because killing someone as part of the judicial system is a fairly cut-and-dry way of saying "we have power over you". Crime and punishment shouldn't be about power, it should be about responsibility.
You know when people go on killing sprees, and then commit suicide afterwards? People always scream "coward" when that happens, but they're invariably the same sort of people who say things like "bring back hanging" when someone is apprehended unscathed. And therein lies the paradox, demonstrating that legislation and support of the Death Penalty is more about voyeur satisfaction than justice. What does their death mean to you when it's their incarceration - and therefore lack of threat to the public - that should matter?

The Death Penalty also implies that for whatever reason, we view death as a solution to a problem. Don't seek to learn more about someone, or their reasons for doing something, just kill them. Why? What is so special about death that it becomes the immediate answer to heinous crime? Death in itself often is a heinous crime, so institutionalising it seems to be another contradiction.
Looking at it from a slightly different perspective, I don't value all human life, but I've no desire to be in charge of it. I'd only ever want to violently harm someone if there was a legitimate context, personal to me. I guess there's another reason for disagreeing with the Death Penalty societally. If someone harmed a member of my family, someone I love, someone I care for deeply, I'd want to rip them to shreds, no mercy, no regrets. But that's me, my decision, my anger and pain. If a reaction to something as horrific as losing a loved one to heinous crime becomes some regimented, chemical process presided over by wardens and doctors, then it has no meaning in relation to the aforementioned reaction, it's not about you and your pain any more.

Unfortunately - in some cases - we don't live in a world where it's up to the people on the receiving end of crime to decide what happens to the perpetrator. So in the world we do inhabit, where like many others I favour progressive, civilised solutions, I think the Death Penalty is out-dated, and always carries the potential for wrongful conviction, and therefore mistakes.

Shangri-LIE
09-16-2011, 08:56 AM
The death penalty is considered by a lot of people to be a draconian, flawed and immoral operation of the corrections system. However barbaric it may seem, it is not a new method of punishment so to speak. We as a species have an inborn proclivity to avenge and to kill. I do not condone murder, but I do support the undertakings of blood justice. With that said...

I do not oppose euthanizing violent criminals. However, I do believe that it should be reserved for the most abhorrent of offenders. I do not support the paradigm of capital punishment as it exists today, but I do believe that capital punishment does need to be examined more objectively and refined to where the amount of innocent people who are condemned to it is greatly reduced. There is always going to be injustice when vengence is persued as unfortunate as that is. Even in war, there are bound to be innocent casualties.

If you ask me, I believe that lifetime incarceration sentences are more inhumane than the death penalty. Imposing Civil Death upon someone is actually less of a "God given right" than to kill someone is. When you think about the fact that passing a sentence that will place a person in isolation for the rest of their lives where they will be prohibited from engaging in every natrual activity, and deprived of every natrual instinct, sensation, and expression that is part of the human essence. That to me is a far more terrifying thought than being put to death.

Cringeon
09-16-2011, 09:40 AM
I don't agree with it as a sentence, but I think anyone who takes actions to intentionally end the lives of others does not deserve to live. I'm all for the unapologetic and confessed murders to forfeit their right to continue on. How is locking someone up with a place to live, food and water a fitting punishment for say people that commit mass murder? I understand people not agreeing with eye for eye, and that to kill the killer we are stooping down to their level; but I really believe there are just evil people out there who will kill just for the sake of doing so.

And I know there are always people who will argue that who defines what is the "worst" and all I can say is that if by allowing a person to live we have given the criminal a more comfortable existence than his victims, that is not justice.

I'm also against just locking people up for life. Not in the sense that I think it's wrong, but in a lot of cases it does nothing but drain resources and keep criminals surrounded with like minded people. The chances of rehabilitation in the current jail/prison system are slim. It does nothing to remove the persons problematic thought patterns and actions from themselves, only removes them from public view. We sleep better knowing they are locked up. I think on one hand we should bring back capital punishment. People don't fear the legal system anymore. Crime is committed knowing they will just go into a situation sometimes better cared for than they were on the outside. Hell, people commit crime just to better their situation. Says something about how people look at jail/prison.

Seven
09-16-2011, 11:49 AM
I agree with Cringeon on this.

There are many violent criminals who will never change, will never stop. They will never take responsibility and even life imprisonment is not enough, especially with the way our prisons are. It is not enough of a punishment. So they get a cushy ride and life rarely means life. While they live, there is a chance they will be let out to offend again or spit in the face of families who never stop suffering the loss of a loved one. I do not believe that all life is sacred because I sure as hell would be prepared to kill to protect those I love.

Shangri-LIE
09-16-2011, 02:32 PM
^ Yup. ...^Yup Yup Yup.

ThreeEyedGod
09-16-2011, 04:51 PM
I agree with Cringeon on this.

There are many violent criminals who will never change, will never stop. They will never take responsibility and even life imprisonment is not enough, especially with the way our prisons are. It is not enough of a punishment. So they get a cushy ride and life rarely means life. While they live, there is a chance they will be let out to offend again or spit in the face of families who never stop suffering the loss of a loved one. I do not believe that all life is sacred because I sure as hell would be prepared to kill to protect those I love.

truth.

Not to mention that some prisoners actually get so accustomed to being locked up and babysat by the state that they enjoy being locked up like dogs. They even find solace in joining a gang and even get access to drugs ( more common than one would think). Hell, they might even enjoy butt fucking and getting ass fucked.

Cringeon
09-16-2011, 05:18 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W-JjldxU-pA

Shangri-LIE
09-16-2011, 05:59 PM
I'd just like to say another thing, even though I've expressed my core sentiments back on page one. We live on a violent planet. A monster producing planet. A planet that is rife with carnage for the purpose of survival. It is a planet that evolves with more and more destructive alpha species than any other history of any other planet known. The mere notion that we can call ourselves civilized is amazing given our circumstances. What I am saying with this is beyond the scope of what I am sure MMT expected it to be, but the whole picture of life is massacre. It's reign then extinction, reign of another tyrannical species then extinction...so on and so on.

What I am really trying to say is that anyone who thinks that they are a humanitarian or even somewhat of a noble person because they oppose the death penalty is an idiot. Either an idiot or just willingly ignorant to the customs of Earth's genealogies. As I said, pertaining to capital punishment, I'ved already given my slant a page back. But I will state once again that if you think you are a better person because you oppose state sponsored execution then you are a hypocrite. You are a hypocrite because you would probably do worse to someone who has killed someone that you love than that of what any institution decides to pass down.

Golden Eel
09-16-2011, 08:35 PM
I'd just like to say another thing, even though I've expressed my core sentiments back on page one. We live on a violent planet. A monster producing planet. A planet that is rife with carnage for the purpose of survival. It is a planet that evolves with more and more destructive alpha species than any other history of any other planet known. The mere notion that we can call ourselves civilized is amazing given our circumstances. What I am saying with this is beyond the scope of what I am sure MMT expected it to be, but the whole picture of life is massacre. It's reign then extinction, reign of another tyrannical species then extinction...so on and so on.

What I am really trying to say is that anyone who thinks that they are a humanitarian or even somewhat of a noble person because they oppose the death penalty is an idiot. Either an idiot or just willingly ignorant to the customs of Earth's genealogies. As I said, pertaining to capital punishment, I'ved already given my slant a page back. But I will state once again that if you think you are a better person because you oppose state sponsored execution then you are a hypocrite. You are a hypocrite because you would probably do worse to someone who has killed someone that you love than that of what any institution decides to pass down.

Yes, that is the story of this planet. But don't you think, as humans, we have the potential to consciously change that path of destruction and carnage? We don't need to kill and murder to survive anymore. Our abilities of thought and problem solving destroy the need for indiscriminate killing. We're 'above' all other known creatures in the entire cosmos in our abilities of thought. The fact that we're discussing this subject, on computer, while being thousands of miles apart from each other proves this. No other known creatures can even come close to what we've become so far. Nature is about massacre, sure. But we have the ability and power to change that. We're not just 'another species' on Earth. As far as we are aware, we're something absolutely in a different category.

You're correct that if someone did horrible harm to me or someone close to me, I would want to kill them. But that doesn't mean I think our justice system should judge people based on our primal emotional instincts. Our emotions are just an ancient reminder of our animal roots. I think our thought processes, the only thing that makes us unique, should trump our animal instincts. I can't understand why anyone would rather judge circumstances with primal urges instead of intellectual thought. I don't think there is any valid argument for returning to these animal roots.

I've got a few drinks in me, so if any of this is unintelligible or repetitive, let me know.

Shangri-LIE
09-16-2011, 08:48 PM
Yes, that is the story of this planet. But don't you think, as humans, we have the potential to consciously change that path of destruction and carnage? We don't need to kill and murder to survive anymore. Our abilities of thought and problem solving destroy the need for indiscriminate killing. We're 'above' all other known creatures in the entire cosmos in our abilities of thought. The fact that we're discussing this subject, on computer, while being thousands of miles apart from each other proves this. No other known creatures can even come close to what we've become so far. Nature is about massacre, sure. But we have the ability and power to change that. We're not just 'another species' on Earth. As far as we are aware, we're something absolutely in a different category.

You're correct that if someone did horrible harm to me or someone close to me, I would want to kill them. But that doesn't mean I think our justice system should judge people based on our primal emotional instincts. Our emotions are just an ancient reminder of our animal roots. I think our thought processes, the only thing that makes us unique, should trump our animal instincts. I can't understand why anyone would rather judge circumstances with primal urges instead of intellectual thought. I don't think there is any valid argument for returning to these animal roots.

I've got a few drinks in me, so if any of this is unintelligible or repetitive, let me know.

No. My answer is no. There is not a semantical nor a linguistic solution to it. Debate will not change anything of something like this. So, no. My answer is no.

ThreeEyedGod
09-16-2011, 09:36 PM
Question: Is it really in man's best interest to completely abandon our " primal animal instinct"? Think about how much of that technological prowess that you hold in such high regard, MMT, is indebted to the organized slaughter we refer to as WAR: a staple of our history and society. Soldier's can also very easily be deemed murderers, and they very well have been, but under very different implications?

For thousands of years man has destroyed one another but yet has still managed to keep going forward(evolving?!) and has still managed to keep creating new civilizations. For if one dismisses this as man being base, brutal, and uncivilized then I really do believe this is a slap in the face of our collective. How unfair to all of the sudden put our foot down and declare that we must all of the sudden change and stop being apes! As Shangri pointed out, it is hypocritical and maybe worst, it edges towards being self righteous.

Nietzsche best summarized how important our "animalistic" side to man with his Apollo/Dyonisus dichotomy philosophy.


"Killing is killing whether it's for duty, profit or fun"

*also under the influence*

The Empirical Guy
09-17-2011, 05:10 AM
I saw your FB status MMT, and I'm glad you carried this discussion through to here.

No, I am not in favour of the death penalty. Why? Because it seems like such an easy way out, to me. If someone has done something terrible, killing them doesn't seem to serve much point to them in terms of punishment - it's more about helping us, the left behind, by giving a sense of revenge to those they hurt, and removing a criminal from our streets for good. For them, though, it doesn't really mean much. Without hard scientific evidence of what happens once we die, it's really rather meaningless. If we knew with absolute certainty that by killing them, we were speeding them to a torturous Hell, then it would be a punishment. However, for all we know it's just ending them, like blowing out a candle, and then what? They'll never have remorse, they'll never suffer like their victims, they'll never think about the life they've missed out on. We can't be certain there's real punishment in it at all, and so I think it's all really rather pointless.

No, I think long term jail sentences are a better punishment. Not with all the mod-cons though, I swear some prisoners these days get given better luxuries than I can afford... give them a a small concrete square with a bucket to shit in, a window slightly too high to see out of, and leave them there. They'll be sorry soon enough. They'll suffer.

While I'm not in favour of the death penalty, though, what I am in favour of is corporal punishment, of the extreme kind. Torture. Of course, for this to be implemented I would require that the convicted be found guilty beyond all doubt: as we've recently seen with the West Memphis 3, sometimes the so called 'Justice System' can fail us, and with punishments like this, you CANNOT afford to make mistakes like that. However, if it is known, 100% that a certain person is guilty of terrible crimes, then make them sorry. Death is a cop out. Make them suffer. Make them beg for mercy. Make them feel what their victims felt, to truly comprehend the suffering they have induced in others. Giving them a last meal and laying them down for a peaceful injection of lethal drugs doesn't do that. Like I said, it's done more for us, than for them. I acknowledge the problem in sufficiently proving that someone is guilty to warrant this kind of punishment though, but that's a separate discussion on the way the legal system works.

This is more about how a basement works. I'm just saiyan.

Hazekiah
09-17-2011, 12:07 PM
Torture's going a bit far, I'd say.

But if someone's ready to kill someone else then they'd BETTER be ready to fucking die themselves.

Yes, in general, killing is bad. But once someone's gone so far as to deliberately ruin and/or end someone else's life by violently criminal and non-consensual means then they've officially broken their end of the social contract and we as a society should have ZERO obligation to continue to uphold our end in terms of not killing them.

And, frankly, if the discussion's turning towards the direction of ridding humanity of these sorts of barbaric impulses...well, removing the worst offenders from the gene pool is a GOOD fucking start, imho.

As I see it, the only real problems with the death penalty involve the degrees of criminality to which it might be unjustly applied and the all-too-frequent problem of wrongful convictions and executions. When former Illinois Governor George H. Ryan placed a *ahem* moratorium on the state's death penalty, it was honestly one of the very few times in my life that I've genuinely been proud of an elected official's actions. Well fucking done, my good sir.

But as long as it's reserved for the worst-of-the-worst and used only in cases with absolutely NO question-of-guilt...then I say fuck 'em.

They started it.

-_-

thedarkhorse
09-19-2011, 06:34 AM
I have never thought that execution was ever a deterrent. If you are going to commit murder you probably aren’t mentally stable enough to be thinking about the consequences. Also I do not have enough faith in the authority to get the right person.

Dronepool
09-20-2011, 07:31 PM
I pretty much agree with Cringeon's opinion on the death penalty. Some people who commit terrible acts of violence never learn and are just a cancer in society.

adamchabbi6
09-21-2011, 11:57 AM
I know this topic causes a very strong debate but I would have to say that the death penalty in the U.S. is definitely a wise idea.

The reason why I agree is because the U.S. has a very large crime rate, e.g. gun crime, etc. If you see the statistics for gun crime in the U.S. in Bowling for Columbine, you will be amazed. So there are clearly thousands of criminals out there who are a threat to innocent civilians in the country and for the safety of those people, the death penalty is the best solution to decrease the amount of murders in the country.

I understand that the death penalty can be cruel and barbaric but at the same time it is a wake up call for those scumbags out there to think twice before going out to harm others who don't deserve to be attacked.

Whereas for the UK, the gun crime is obviously not as bad compared to the U.S. since guns are illegal here but if the UK went back to having the death penalty like they used to have many decades back, it would certainly help the crime rate to reduce a lot more.

The bottom line is to protect the innocent people and preventing them to be killed. Some of you may disagree which is alright. Although, I believe that my perspective is pretty reasonable.

cyborg assassin
09-22-2011, 08:42 AM
I'm neither ardently for or against it. I wouldn't actively campaign to bring it back, but don't immediately denounce other places for having it. I think what's more of an issue to me is what people are being executed for. Iran executing people for 'adultery' or the Soviet Union executing people who didn't believe in Communism are a lot more objectional than Texas executing a serial killer for example.

The problem of the chance of innocent people being put to death is the thing that perhaps stops me from whole heartedly favouring the death penalty. In some potential circumstances though I could see it being necessary and don't have an absolutist view on the matter. In response to those who claim the death penalty is barbaric, I don't think it is any worse than life in jail. In fact, I bet life in some jails makes the death penalty look a decent alternative.

Emma
09-22-2011, 11:37 AM
I am against the death penalty for the most part. It's not a deterrent, it is more expensive and it has been known to kill innocents. That being said I think some people - rapists, murderers (those who kill for the sheer pleasure of it) and child abusers are the people I would say are an exception to the rule.

Enigma
10-21-2011, 10:09 AM
I'm against it, absolutely. If you're condemnig someone for his bad acts you just can't do the same. Killing is killing, and you can't kill somebody because he has already killed before. You become the same shit as him, practically. So let them die in prison, but no be killed in it, because there has to be a difference between a murderer and the person who only wants justice. It has to be like "you did that, and we're not gonna do you the same, because we are better people than you, but you're gonna spend the rest of your days in this fucking room". The thing about prison is that most of the people see it a a punishment, and it should be viewed as a place were you keep away the people who can't live peacefully with others, because there is no option left. The ones that can reincorporate into the society must have an oportunity, the ones that cannot must stay there. But just because they are a danger, not because we should punish anyone for that. Only the family of the victim, God or whatever could really punish his acts, I think.

Not to mention when they kill an innocent...

Golden Eel
04-25-2012, 12:04 PM
What do new(er) users think of this?

I've seen a few news stories in the past week or so that have brought this back up. Today, the Governor of Connecticut abolished the death penalty. Also, there will be a measure on the ballot in California to end it there, too.

Seeing so many ignorant comments on the news articles has forced me to bring this thread back around.

Sticky Killer Jones
04-25-2012, 04:01 PM
Someone who had done something pretty awful to a relative of mine was eyeballed for probably being executed in trial. He got 15 life sentences instead, no parole. I figure anything I might have wanted to do to him before the cops got him is going to be done to him by fellow inmates till he dies. Not that it makes me feel good to reflect on that. Used to, but not anymore.

In the end, killing him wouldn't have enacted any sort of closure. He did what he did, he wasn't sorry, he'll never be sorry. Nobody is healed.

Maybe I'm too much of a softie and most of his family disowned him due to learning nasty details of his inhumanity, it would have haunted me thinking about his mother, who clung to him all through the trial. I was never fond of her, but, destroying her would have just deepened the hole. If that makes sense.

I'm not a pacifist. If someone is a direct danger to you at that second, use force, even if that ends up resorting to killing them. Executing someone who's already captured and unable to harm you in that state is a different ballgame, one I'd rather leave to the hands of time than playing God. Or more specifically, the state playing God.

rusty shackleford
05-01-2012, 12:40 AM
I am against the death penalty but agree with deadly force if necessary like Killer Jones said.

zlatna.
05-02-2012, 09:30 AM
morally, the death penalty is wrong. 'killing is killing, whether done for duty, profit, or fun.' not talking politically about the overpopulation of the planet or the weighing the expenses of both options, strictly morally.

generally, the people who commit these crimes are unwell psychologically, either due to upbringing or genetics. though the action itself was the perpetrators decision, the reasoning behind it is always misguided or completely demented. so in the end, are they really to blame for their hostility or wrongdoings?

so what does it say about us, as a society, when our solution to these delinquents is to kill them?

i try to wrap my head around it and it seems so barbaric.

crazybitch
08-10-2012, 10:50 AM
Good point. I am mostly against the death penatly. I feel sorry for the people who commit crimes sometimes completely unknowingly, or at least of the consequences. I don't believe the death penalty should be given to a person acting of a chemical imbalance not caused through substance abuse. I still think they should go to jail and pay for their crimes. I also feel that insanity or mental instability should never be an excuse, and I believe in punishment just not in the form of taking a life to prove something is wrong. They still have to be punished, even if they didn't know what they did because if they didn't many criminals and idiots would aim for the insanity plea.

Two Faced Egg (23)
05-26-2015, 01:46 PM
Mosaic Law versus Sharia Law , I don't Wanna DIE ! Lol'Ss .. Either have the Covicts do a lot more hard labor for Big Corporations 0r "put them to Sleep" , thou shalt not Kill .. ( ? ) just let me live in 2 foot by 3 foot cell , while making products for General Electric or Lockheed Martin all Fucking Day' Cheers' TFE

blue angel
05-26-2015, 05:44 PM
I used to not believe in the death penalty, but I have now changed my mind. There are just too many fuckers alive in this world sitting awaiting their day. I believe that it should be immediate and done by firing squad.

Nemoris Inferioris
05-29-2015, 09:58 AM
I would much rather Die than to rot in a prison for the Rest Of My Life, so i don't know, since i am not a felon (As Of Now, lol). Depends on their crime.
If you steal, then absolutely no. If i was a cop, i'd just make them give back what they stole and give the victim 100$ or something, especially if it is a kid or 20 y/o. They shouldn't go to jail for a stupid crime they did when they we're dumb and young.
If you commit murder, eye for an eye. You should die for taking someone else's life. Rape, your genitals should be removed (Painfully or painlessly). You don't deserve them. Just what i believe. But i am thinking on my POV, not their POV, so it is different.

YoureAlreadyHere
05-29-2015, 01:04 PM
For a government that boasts personal rights and liberties, the death penalty is too much of a pain in the ass to implement, draining our system of money, time, and energy.

1 incorrect condemnation is 1 mistake too much. Especially imposed by our government. Pathetic, really.

Outside of government use, if a person were to kill another person, I would hope that they were to suffer. Each perpetrator is different, and I wish we could focus in on each, rather than mandatory bullshit, blah... life and death may be mechanical, but the murder of another person is anything but, and should be punished exclusively to the details involved. . . this is my heart's desire, of course, but in order to Evolve as species AND a society, I think that horrific murderers should be left alive in order to be studied. . .

I also think that our prison systems should use solitary confinement more... they are too cushy and too connected to the outside world, and eachother. Auburn Silent System, anyone? Work them during the day (maintain silence), solitary confinement in the afternoon and night... the work will keep them aware, the confinement will drill in their ends. I don't know that death is quick, painless, etc. Torture of solitary confinement seems the most decisive way to reprimand a murderer.

I am torn... part of me wants to fix the problem, the neurological mockery of our species... the other part of me wants to kill the brutal murderers and rapists with my own hands. Not because I want control or to be a Godhead, but because I am disappointed & disgusted in another's lack of humanity...

Another point, and my last... the hands that press the button, pull the trigger, swing the blade.. our government pays people in our prison system to end another human being's life. Generally, with lethal injection, there are multiple "executioners" whom each have their own button... each drug released random to the button pusher. Did I send in the potassium chloride? Did I? Did you? Did we? What does this do to the prison system employee? What is our government creating? Is is justice to subject a human being to taking the life of another human being, regardless if it is a group of three individuals or thousands committing the act? Is it really protecting our society, protecting our society's psyche?

Can't we just send them all to an island and let them rape and kill each other? Talk about Utopian.

Our system is flawed by naive sentiments of "justice" and laced with loopholes determined to befit our ideologies of personal rights... our justice is revenge, our rights are bullshit manipulated for the plutarch's gains. It is all a Catch 22.

Iulian
05-29-2015, 01:20 PM
Iīd only choose the death penalty for some people, like the ones who wonīt stop killing people for whatever reason; for (and there was a case here in Spain) a serial rapist who, 18 hours after getting out of prison, raped a girl; for incredible sick people who donīt even know what they are doing (only because I think death would be easier than being bounded to a bed for 40 years etc.

Also, let people in the last state of cancer&such choose when to end their lives.

VelvetAIDS
05-30-2015, 03:23 AM
Our system is flawed by naive sentiments of "justice" and laced with loopholes determined to befit our ideologies of personal rights... our justice is revenge, our rights are bullshit manipulated for the plutarch's gains. It is all a Catch 22.

This sums up my personal opinion rather well. High five(s).

Golden Eel
05-30-2015, 08:07 PM
I also think that our prison systems should use solitary confinement more... they are too cushy and too connected to the outside world, and eachother. Auburn Silent System, anyone? Work them during the day (maintain silence), solitary confinement in the afternoon and night... the work will keep them aware, the confinement will drill in their ends. I don't know that death is quick, painless, etc. Torture of solitary confinement seems the most decisive way to reprimand a murderer.

If I can address this particular point... Everything you said here is really, really needlessly cruel. People (most of them like you) are blood-thirsty and have a burning desire to see revenge enacted. Most people want to see people who break crimes (i.e. people who do something they disagree with) punished which is just completely absurd to me. You want our judicial system to in essence act like a cranky 5 year old? Bad man did bad thing so let's do mean things to him! Insane. Actively making our prison system harsher and more cruel is really sick and completely backwards. It's really saddening that there are so many people who are trying to actively hold back the social evolution of humanity.

Shangri-LIE
05-31-2015, 08:32 PM
There are consequences for your actions. However, I think that they should start teaching children about the horrors of prison that exceed any "Beyond Scared Straight" program. Prison is a living grave. You are deprived of your freedom of mobility. Your sex life is dead. You are essentially in a coffin only where you can hear people screaming all around you. The deprivation of sleep, choices, control of your own mind that begins to slip when all you see are bars and concrete all day and all night. The person shitting in a steel toilet right beside your bed with no air freshener and no room to escape to, to get away from the smell. Another person watching you masturbate and if you get caught, as self gratification is prohibited in most prisons, you will be disciplined for it. You are property. You do not belong to yourself.

It is like being put to bed early in a one piece pajama suit for the rest of your life right off the side of the road where you can see people leaving to go home to have a beer and unwind and possibly fuck their spouse. You have no means of releasing tension unless you decide to aggressively snap and kill or rape someone. If we start showing people what prison really is like, not like on Tv and in the movies, then maybe that can be somewhat of a deterrent? I could be more graphic. However, the message is that Prison is a tomb that you are aware that you are in. It's like being buried alive...and their is no panic button or bell to ring.

I know that has nothing to do with the death penalty, but I think preventing people from committing crimes by literally telling them all of these things or showing it to them, perhaps even making them experience it for a while, may just be what we need. We do it with sex education classes. "Hey, kid. If you don't wrap your d-ick up you're going to get AIDS and die or get someone pregnant. Here, have a piece of candy and shut the fuck up." essentially. It makes them realize the gravity of the situation. You are not a human being in prison.

As for the death penalty, despite what I've said just to be a fucking twit, I am opposed to it, though I am in favor of vigilantism. I just don't think it should be state or federally sponsored and executed. No pun intended.

Edit - What I mean by me supporting vigilantism is that by killing someone who has accosted you or someone that you know or love, (in extreme cases where their lives have been put in peril or possibly taken), and you can prove that it was them...Then that should be perfectly legal. Mob justice.

YoureAlreadyHere
05-31-2015, 09:18 PM
If I can address this particular point... Everything you said here is really, really needlessly cruel. People (most of them like you) are blood-thirsty and have a burning desire to see revenge enacted. Most people want to see people who break crimes (i.e. people who do something they disagree with) punished which is just completely absurd to me. You want our judicial system to in essence act like a cranky 5 year old? Bad man did bad thing so let's do mean things to him! Insane. Actively making our prison system harsher and more cruel is really sick and completely backwards. It's really saddening that there are so many people who are trying to actively hold back the social evolution of humanity.

Yes, I do think that people who, without a doubt (don't get into "reasonable doubt") rape and murder children deserve AT LEAST the auburn silent system. Yes, I do, believe that people who target and kill people (serial killers) deserve at least the silent auburn system. Yes, I would probably, were I deeply entrenched in a child rape (and/or murder) case, deeply want to kill the perpetrator. When a person decides it is okay to take one's innocence and manipulate it for their own twisted gains, they cross the line from human to inhumane, and any humane thought or mannerism towards perpetrator would swiftly be tossed away. On that note, no, I do not necessarily believe in rehabilitation on the above fronts. I do believe that said animalistic "people" can suffer, and by taking away their freedom, interactions, and CHANCES to endanger others for the remainder of their existence would at least make them suffer enough to possibly Consider the fault in their actions and, ultimately, their mindsets. Then again, that is just my logic.
Blood thirsty? Sure, why not. Keep in mind, I am not talking about your average "criminal". I am talking about sadistic sociopaths and rapists.
Please don't blur the lines. I dont agree with our prison system, for the most part. It is a revolving door and is there for money making reasons, both federally funded and private.

Maybe I should add some rainbows and glitter for effect.

Cat
06-01-2015, 04:00 AM
I used to not believe in the death penalty, but I have now changed my mind. There are just too many fuckers alive in this world sitting awaiting their day. I believe that it should be immediate and done by firing squad.

If we use violence to solve our problems, then we will just create more violence...... won't we?!

Shangri-LIE
06-01-2015, 04:53 AM
If we use violence to solve our problems, then we will just create more violence...... won't we?!

Americans are different. We don't respond very well to education and/or positive reinforcement. Fear and suffering/punishment is engrained into our culture.

blue angel
06-01-2015, 01:14 PM
If we use violence to solve our problems, then we will just create more violence...... won't we?!

We are naturally prone to violence inherently, we stop ourselves through learned proper behavior not to be violent at whim, some more than others have that natural impulse. But, I just think that we have too many people who have killed and would absolutely kill again and they are just wasting away in jail cells and it is a waste of everything, so just put them to their death. I would also hope that if this happened, it would cause others who might kill to think of approaching their hate and murderous impulse to react in another way, for fear of losing their own precious lives. Life is only precious to most people when it is their own life in question of being disposed of. Most people are shitty to each other , especially if they feel that they can get away with it and not have consequences, or even serve lenient ones at that.
I care about the human condition, but looking at it honestly leaves much to be desired. I am seeing us all as much more of a failure that needs closure and a restart, in my darkest hours, I suppose.

Celebrity Killing Spree
06-01-2015, 01:43 PM
Unless my life or anyone else's is in immediate danger at the hands of a perpetrator, I'm against anybody killing in my name.

blue angel
06-01-2015, 02:01 PM
I have known murderers and all were very different cases, but the one thing that they all have in common, is that life only mattered to them when it was their own lives being in question, due to their well thought out activities. All killed at selfish whim too, not out of protecting a life.

Cat
06-02-2015, 01:57 AM
I have known murderers and all were very different cases, but the one thing that they all have in common, is that life only mattered to them when it was their own lives being in question, due to their well thought out activities. All killed at selfish whim too, not out of protecting a life.

What you describe here is the nature of a psychopath.

And yes, it would be very easy to just exterminate them, but it still wouldn't solve our problems because psychopaths are born everyday.

So I think we need to find a more suitable cure.

Penance Sentence
06-02-2015, 09:09 AM
I'm a reserved person. I usually don't care to comment on things like these, but there's a time for everything. I don't really have to say much whether the death penalty is right or wrong. I don't care for an arbiter of morality. I just have to say that it can be sad, that many monsters are faced with that path.
Your sons, husbands, daughters, and wives. Most people aren't born murderers. Most people are born human. And sometimes, caged animals behave like animals. You don't say, right? The death penalty is just stupid, not for a morality issue of whether killing is right or wrong, but it's just a stupid excuse for a corporate enterprise to discard of its "collateral."

The fuck out of here. The prisons themselves are mega cash-ins.
Some never asked to be born in broken environments, with the weight of the world crushing them since birth. Don't be surprised when they merely react to their environment.

Cat
08-11-2015, 03:02 AM
Americans are different. We don't respond very well to education and/or positive reinforcement. Fear and suffering/punishment is engrained into our culture.

I see.

filthytothecore
11-05-2015, 12:01 AM
Yes of course I am, Death penalty, for DRUGS drug sellers, pedos and that assorted shit as well as murders preferably the latter two crucified.

YoureAlreadyHere
11-14-2015, 09:13 AM
There is no cure. This world is a disease; full of idiocy and ill-placed passion. Violence and more violence; cash in, ship out. Isolate the manipulator and save the masses