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Thread: The Line Between The New Shit and The Old Shit

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    Default The Line Between The New Shit and The Old Shit

    During the GB tour, Manson used to address GOAG tracks as the "New Shit", and would often refer to Sweet Dreams as the "Old Shit". I think its quite clear Manson has evolved a great deal as an artist over a years (for better or worse is not relevant), but where do you think the 2 clear era's dividing point was?

    Personally, I view 2003-2005 as a transitional period, however 2006 - with the announcement of Phantasmagoria and This Is Halloween, was the clear beginning of modern Manson. His gimmick stripped back, and he became a lot more subtle - obviously a lot more personal in his music as well.
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    Depends on who you ask.

    - When they dropped "and The Spooky Kids"
    - When Scott got kicked
    - When Twiggy left
    - When Twiggy came back

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    ^ Cringeon has a good point as it really depends on when you got in to the band. There are a lot of people that would say 'new' Manson was when the Spooky Kids got dropped, or Scott left. I've heard Sweet Dreams used as a point of reference as it divides those who knew the band before mainstream commercial success with the influx of new fans at the time.
    I think what you say about 2006 being the start of the newer era, with things being stripped back and more personal, make a lot of sense. However, perhaps the most identifiable dividing line is simple the Triptych - anything after HW being described as 'new' Manson. You could also divide things in to thirds: Old Manson being up to and including ACSS, Mid-period being MA, HW and GAOG, and new Manson being EMDM and onwards. That's just a rough chronological division though, as opposed to any sort of theme within those records.
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    I'd definitely go with the post-Triptych years being "new" Manson, personally. I feel like, time-wise, it would be off to consider it when Spooky Kids ended because that was so long ago and everything since has been for such a longer period of time that it would be crazy to consider Marilyn Manson 20 years ago "New". I think MM himself could tell after the Triptych that it was the end of an era in his career (in fact, and it's on a bookshelf somewhere around here, in Chuck Palahniuk's collection of journalistic pieces and interviews, there's an interview with Manson right around Holy Wood and he even says as much), and everything since has been the "new". I mean, that's nearly a fifty-fifty split anyway, so it makes the most sense to me.
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    We are currently at the point where with BV, he has equal amount of albums before and after the era of HW. Anything new album wise will tip the scales more.to the latter.

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    Quote Originally Posted by The Empirical Guy View Post
    ^ Cringeon has a good point as it really depends on when you got in to the band. There are a lot of people that would say 'new' Manson was when the Spooky Kids got dropped, or Scott left. I've heard Sweet Dreams used as a point of reference as it divides those who knew the band before mainstream commercial success with the influx of new fans at the time.
    I think what you say about 2006 being the start of the newer era, with things being stripped back and more personal, make a lot of sense. However, perhaps the most identifiable dividing line is simple the Triptych - anything after HW being described as 'new' Manson. You could also divide things in to thirds: Old Manson being up to and including ACSS, Mid-period being MA, HW and GAOG, and new Manson being EMDM and onwards. That's just a rough chronological division though, as opposed to any sort of theme within those records.
    However I can never compare MA to GOAG, they seem worlds apart to me - like different artists. Same with GOAG to EMDM. This is why I'm often led to believe GOAG stands completely alone, along with LWF and the AAG tour.
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    Twiggy > Everyone else.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Cringeon View Post
    Twiggy > Everyone else.
    Twiggy = Overrated

    At this point that's pretty clear...He's a great bassist but as a songwriter he gets too much credit. Fact is they had great producers doing all the "classic" records and also Twiggy mixed well with the guitarists on hand at the time. Left to his own devices he's not capable of delivering on that scale.

    They need a producer and an awesome guitarist.

    Skold + Twiggy > Any lineup...but it won't happen

    I'd say there are a few lines.

    - 'Antichrist Superstar' - death of Spooky Kids, beginning of superstardom

    - 'Golden Age of Grotesque' - departure of Twiggy, a fresh more modern sound

    - 'EAT ME DRINK ME' - mid-life crisis, decline from superstardom, and focus on emo-tions

    The next album or whatever he does is probably going to be the beginning of a new New Shit...I expect a lot of humor, marijuanna, AIDS, and irreverence. Basically music that actually suits his newfound goofiness...and I don't know how the fuck that will sound or if it will even involve a band per say, but I'm all ears.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nursing Home View Post
    Twiggy = Overrated

    At this point that's pretty clear...He's a great bassist but as a songwriter he gets too much credit. Fact is they had great producers doing all the "classic" records and also Twiggy mixed well with the guitarists on hand at the time. Left to his own devices he's not capable of delivering on that scale.
    He delivered just fine on guitar on "classic" MM albums, so don't really get what you mean. His solo/Goon Moon stuff is (imo) tons better than the solo stuff done by Skold/John5 post MM and sure let's count the few things Scott has done (no one can compete with mmii lol). Twiggy's abilities as a song writer far eclipse the technical ability of other people in the band, MM's pretty much said as much and I think he'd have the most objective POV. Plus I think the work done outside of the band is evidence enough.

    I would like to see them work with an outside producer, I like the work Sardy did on HW and w/Twiggy when they did the Oasis remixes. MM has always been the constant between all the "classic" albums, I doubt the producers on their own would have crafted what made those albums so special. Also we've really only had one album that was produced by MM alone, so I'm not sure the co-producers would have as much profound impact.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Nursing Home View Post
    Twiggy = Overrated
    He's a great bassist but as a songwriter he gets too much credit.
    That is hilarious to me.


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