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Thread: Other Manson "Fans"

  1. #1
    Not man enough to b human Manson15Marilyn's Avatar
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    Default Other Manson "Fans"

    As many of you may know already, I don't particularly get along with a lot of other MM fans here. Well, it doesn't go so well in my everyday life either. To me, other Marilyn Manson fans are less bearable to deal with than those evangelical, gun-toting, patriotic rednecks here in the midwest (and probably in a small town near you). For starters, many of them are younger than me. But even among MM fans my age - or even older - a lot of them seem pretentious, passive-aggressive, and just plain rude more than half of the time. Here are a few examples of what I mean:

    - When I'm playing The High End of Low or Born Villain, pretty much anything but "The Trilogy" I get a lot of "Ugh, why don't you just play one of his good albums", and ranting on about how terrible the music has become. And its like, "If you don't like it you can always not be at my house/in my car, etc." Because I'll listen to it on headphones in public. This is usually when my friends' friends or brother's friends are around or something who happen to be Manson fans, too.

    - When I'm talking with randumb Manson fans or something and we talk about "favourites", everyone gets a "turn" to explain what's their favourite and why they like it etc. But my turn comes around and I say anything that has nothing to do with that "Trilogy" I'm cut off every. Fucking. Time with feedback like "Ugh, why would you like that shit", "that shit is so stoopid", and my personal favourite "Yeah, good for you... What about you [insert common whitepeople name here]."

    - When another Manson fan is talking about one of those trilogy albums and asks my honest opinion about them, and I tell them that honest opinion. Now I usually say good things about it but I don't talk about it like its god's gift to the world and I don't get all giddy talking about it either. In that moment, their big smile fades away and they begin to glare and accusing me of hating Manson or something along those lines.

    Now, since its Provider Module, I'm sure most of you don't have problems with other Manson fans. But I for one don't seem to fit the status quo. I wonder, though, are there any people here who might have a similar experience? Does anybody else commonly have these kinds of problems with other Manson fans? Do you run into other Manson fans that don't seem to jive with you? Let's discuss life around other Marilyn Manson fans today. I'm sure it'll pass the time while we wait on this new album.
    I am your vulture, your immoral sculpture, mirrorman who understands. I know you. I am you, your fantasy, reality.

    Don't be surprised I can look you in the eye. It's hard to take you serious when you take me inside.

    How the fuck are we supposed to know when I'm a monster in the way you refuse to die? How the fuck are we supposed to know if we're in love or if we're in pain?
    "Are we in love or are we in pain?"

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  3. #2
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    If you talk to the ones with titties it solves most of these problems.
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  5. #3
    Not man enough to b human Manson15Marilyn's Avatar
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    A number of them had big titties. Some smaller titties. Get the same thing no matter the gender, though. :|
    I am your vulture, your immoral sculpture, mirrorman who understands. I know you. I am you, your fantasy, reality.

    Don't be surprised I can look you in the eye. It's hard to take you serious when you take me inside.

    How the fuck are we supposed to know when I'm a monster in the way you refuse to die? How the fuck are we supposed to know if we're in love or if we're in pain?
    "Are we in love or are we in pain?"

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    Lord of the Rings>Star Wars

  7. #5
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    People suck ass, buddy. Each is entitled to their own opinion, no matter how absurd or backwards it may be; including you. Every fan is a fan for a different reason. Be wary* of those you interact with; and it is typically easy to spot a shallow bullshitter.

    And remember, just because they like Manson doesn't mean they like you even though we all secretly dream of being able to share our manson obsession with another breathing thing.

    I'd encourage you to get a soft cat.
    Last edited by YoureAlreadyHere; 01-27-2017 at 11:45 AM. Reason: spelling
    --------------------------------

    Don't tell me what to do.

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  9. #6
    HEAVEN UPSIDE DOWN Hazekiah's Avatar
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    The very concept of fandom itself connotes a certain, elevated propensity towards being perhaps overly opinionated.

    So one is naturally far more likely to encounter divisiveness even within a subsect of, say, music fans than they would if they just asked the opinion of some random passerby who occasionally just listens to the radio for background noise, for instance.

    That said, it's pretty frustrating sometimes, I agree. I have a lot of recent, personal, unfortunate experience with being banned from NIN and Transformers message boards, just to use those as a handy, corollary example. What it basically boiled down to in both cases was that I was an unapologetic and enthusiastic fan with a spine who was willing to stand up for myself when challenged. For whatever reason, you're basically not allowed to be a fan of Marilyn Manson on certain NIN message boards unless you append a caveat to every post suggesting that it's a guilty pleasure you're embarrassed by and ashamed of to the point that any note of appreciation comes in the form of a backhanded compliment. If you do that, you're okay and "part of the group." If you don't then you're not and the community eventually rejects you to the point that you become the butt of all jokes and the whipping boy of the forum, even to the point that the staff itself essentially joins in on the discriminatory mistreatment and effectively endorses it by banning you. Same goes for Transformers message boards. If you're a fan of the live action movies then it really doesn't matter if you were a lifelong fan of the toys, comics, and cartoons before that, you're basically the worst kind of fan and need to be expelled because you actually just really like the movies and aren't afraid to admit it. The Manson threads on a NIN site and Transformers Movies subforums on a TF site are mercilessly over-moderated and discriminatory in their bias against their very subject matter or anyone who enjoys it...and that's just your own damned fault because you happen to be a NIN or TF fan in general as well.

    And it's fucking stupid of course but that's just they way fansites are sometimes, I guess.

    Manson fans are of course no exception, although I think the very nature of being a Manson fan -- that is, Manson's core messages and the outcast, unpopular, and generally shit-upon audience that embraces them -- seemingly lends itself to a more open-minded and less restrictive community, a quality the staff at Provider Module has carefully curated without descending into the troll-happy free-for-all downfall to which so many others have succumbed. So hopefully you'll fare better here than you might out amongst the general populace. If you can't make it HERE then it might be time to dig a little deeper than just WTF IS WRONG WITH EVERYONE ELSE, lol.

    But that's more specific to the subject of online superfans than what I think you meant to discuss more generally.

    Naturally, most fans of any given artist have favorite and least favorite albums. Personally, I take a more all-encompassing stance on the matter -- I don't shit on ANY of the albums because I love them ALL -- but I'll admit I seem to be a bit of an outlier in that respect. And I could easily say the same about the Transformers films. I've actually gotten hate-mail from fellow fans because I won't pick a Least Favorite Manson Album or a Least Favorite Transformers Movie. Because I can't. I love them ALL or I wouldn't be the superfan I am, I'd just find something else to sink my teeth into instead. I don't HAVE a least favorite and I won't pretend to or put myself in some Sophie's Choice predicament just to satisfy someone who wants the reassurance that even a superfan hates whatever, too.

    But I digress again. My point in saying all this is that the all-or-nothing attitude isn't as common as picking-and-choosing or "cafeteria-style" fandom and it's to be expected that you'll encounter more of the latter out in the wild than you will the former. But even with online Manson-nerds you'll find a lot of disparity and disagreement, if only because Manson's been around for almost a quarter-of-a-century now plus he's gone out of his way to change so drastically from album to album so many times. It's kind of par for the course that he loses and gains fans each time out because, well, they were mostly just dipping their toes in when he met them halfway but maybe weren't really ready for the FULL-ON Manson experience or willing to accept his personality without it first being filtered through a different lens more to their liking. Which is fine. It's just kind of a different level and/or variety of fandom so, again, differences of opinion and degrees of tolerance are simply to be expected in such a case as his.

    Manson has drawn a large, multifaceted crowd and he's done so over the course of decades, no less.

    Any fans of anything that's gone through so many disparate and ever-varied iterations over such a lengthy span of time are BOUND to find differences amongst themselves (again, NIN and Transformers leap to mind), and that's okay. Reinvention is a time-tested recipe for freshness yet not always palatable to everyone, after all. And SURE, that makes for some strange bedfellows sometimes but it ALSO promotes diversity and longevity despite whatever disagreement and strife comes along for the ride.

    What's MOST important is that out of the ENTIRE WORLD of options available we can ALL AGREE that there's something SPECIAL about the thing we all like TOGETHER, no matter which version of whatever that thing we're enjoying may be.

    THAT is what makes a COMMUNITY, keeps it healthy and inviting, and what I think gets cast aside and forgotten all too readily and all too frequently.

    Speaking of which, PROVIDER MODULE IS FUCKING AWESOME, btw!

    <3


    And it's the fucking TRIPTYCH not the the "trilogy," ffs.
    Last edited by Hazekiah; 02-02-2017 at 06:07 AM.

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  11. #7
    Ruination cataract777's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Manson15Marilyn View Post
    - When another Manson fan is talking about one of those trilogy albums and asks my honest opinion about them, and I tell them that honest opinion. Now I usually say good things about it but I don't talk about it like its god's gift to the world and I don't get all giddy talking about it either. In that moment, their big smile fades away and they begin to glare and accusing me of hating Manson or something along those lines.

    Now, since its Provider Module, I'm sure most of you don't have problems with other Manson fans. But I for one don't seem to fit the status quo. I wonder, though, are there any people here who might have a similar experience? Does anybody else commonly have these kinds of problems with other Manson fans? Do you run into other Manson fans that don't seem to jive with you? Let's discuss life around other Marilyn Manson fans today. I'm sure it'll pass the time while we wait on this new album.
    There are many different kinds of fans. Some are neutral on many aspects of the band, some are in the middle, and some are fanboys. I really like the band, obviously, that's why I'm here. I do happen to like all of their records, some more than others of course. But I do tend to share some opinions that others may not agree with, which they have the right to do.

    The only fan that annoys me would be the fanboy type. I haven't had that fanboy mentality since the 90's, when I was reallly young. Therefore it's a bit hard for me to remember what it was like. But I can imagine it through some users on this forum. Nowadays, with bands, I'm pretty neutral. I'll get excited about particular things (for example, the upcoming release of SAY10) but I don't instantly love everything that is put out by the band just to keep up with the idea that I'm a "fan". Some things I like and some things I don't. This forum is for discussion of the band and what they put out, and we won't always like the same things. There's not one band that I listen to that doesn't have a record or whatever that I don't enjoy as much as the others.

    Every now and then I'll share my opinion on a particular song and there's some people who come a long and say "You don't like anything", as they proceed to gush about said song. Like we're not allowed to give a critical opinion about anything. Either you really love it with all your being, or you're not a true Manson fan. There are songs I like and some songs I don't. I feel that's a normal way to feel. For example, when Deep Six was released, I stated that I like the instrumental and the verses, but I wasn't a fan of the screeching screams when Manson yelled "Deep six-six-six feet deep." And someone came along also and said I'm always complaining. That kind of thing is annoying.

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  13. #8
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  15. #9

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    I agree with everything Hazekiah's saying, particularly when it comes to odd fuckers who feel the need for 'teams' when it comes to musical fandom, and a sort of 'musical elitism.' I mean, I'm sure most of us have been with a group of mates talkin' tunes, and while you may have broad, varied, eclectic tastes and while that may be known, the minute you bring up Manson, you're scoffed at by someone for liking a silly basic goth-kid band for twelve-year-olds in their fuck-you-mom phases.

    As for me, the division I've always noticed between Manson fans are those who are fans of 'the music of Marilyn Manson' (Group A) and those who are fans of 'the concept of Marilyn Manson' including the music (Group B), in which I'm in the latter group. That's not to say I'm a 'fanboy' by most definitions, there are songs and albums I genuinely do not like, not everything Manson does is stellar or even good. But, I am far detached from the former group, who do not care whatsoever about anything other than 'how do the songs sound?' In a large sense this division applies to fans of all rock-oriented music, but it's what I often notice the most between Manson fans. I notice that many in Group A are largely younger fans, who came of age in the modern indie culture of rock music, where if you don't act and dress like an apathetic hobo and strive to be as boring as possible, you're a pretentious sellout tosser. Let's just say 'The Noel and Liam Gallagher idea of what music should be' (disclaimer: I adore Oasis). For me, I genuinely believe in Marilyn Manson as the poet, the critic, the philosopher, the revolutionary, the artist. I believe what he's done with his art and his public existence has had a pretty large impact on western society, and on various mediums of art, and that his lyrics contain an insane level of genuine intellectualism and references you just don't see with your usual rock and roll band.

    Group A despises this idea, the idea of a 'legend.' John Lennon was some long haired dude who wrote Sgt. Peppers, Jim Morrison was a guy who read books and fancied leather pants, David Bowie wore makeup and a clown hat, and that is fucking it. To a degree, yes, the manufacturing of rock and roll Gods out of just regular people is arguably bullshit (although I kind of miss rock gods), but they take it a step further, believing that anything outside of what sound is coming out of the 4-5 dudes playing instruments is irrelevant and against what music should be. Try to form a band with a few unique personalities, and you'll eventually get into the debate over whether you should incorporate theatricality, or other mediums of artistic expression, or social commentary, or something 'deeper' than just the music, or whether you should be five guys in jeans holding instruments and nothing more.

    So I'm in Group B. While I offer my apologies to anyone here who lives in hickfuck nowhere, devoid of the kinds of people who would be into Manson, I've got a number of friends who are real big fans of the guy. While I love talking about the albums and the songs, I also enjoy conversations on topics like the political atmosphere around varying points in his career, the Columbine massacre, his social impacts, the various artistic or literary influences contained in his work and visuals, changing public perceptions towards his subject matter, etc. etc. To me, 'Marilyn Manson' is a force, an idea, a feeling, a concept, a multi-faceted decades long art project and social experiment.

    While not as loudly these days, I noticed a large surge in Group A types in this forum and the Heirophant around EMDM and continuing through BV. I mean, this was an age of comparatively less impact on the world and pop culture, and less critical praise and whathaveyou, and a lot of fans tried to pivot what they appreciated to simply and solely the music itself, maybe as a coping mechanism of sorts for feeling the 'magic' had been lost. They couldn't care less if Manson was just some guy with a white beard living recluse in a shack somewhere occasionally putting out albums. While that's not to say a band or artist can't do that and not be awesome, a band *can* be more, and Manson was and is. I'd be criticized by people saying 'it's just songs, it's just a guy making money putting out albums and playing live,' and I disagree. I'm no die-hard screaming-girl fanboy, there's many bands I love way more than Manson, and some of the man's work I couldn't care less about. He's not the messiah, but I do believe in 'The Legend of Marilyn Manson.' I believe one day, when Manson is old or passed, he'll be appreciated for a hell of a lot more than a dozen or so albums of tunes.

    Holy fuck would a Beatles Anthology-esque series on Marilyn Manson be the tits.

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  17. #10
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    I am on the fence about this one. Why? Because I don't see being a Manson fan as an identity. But there are people whose identity and only redeemable qualities are based on being a fan of Marilyn Manson alone. And that is really all there is to their character, thought process and how they live their lives concurrent with whatever era that may be. I don't get along with those types of fans and I sure as hell won't ever date someone off of a forum again. - lol - But then you have fans who are actually really cool and are capable of discussing other things, have their own thought processes, understand that he's an artist and no a savior figure, who also tend to be more genuine in encounters/establishing a friendship and/or just an acquaintanceship with.
    OMNOMNOMNOMNOMNOMNOM


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