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Thread: Do you enjoy Born Villain more than The Pale Emperor?

  1. #31
    HEAVEN UPSIDE DOWN Hazekiah's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by kk_15 View Post
    I did, and since listening to TPE more seriously I appreciate it more at least, the production is miles better but BV has a unique rough-around-the-edges charm to it and was a soundtrack for a personal revolution within my life.
    I like them both, but for what they are and to compare MM albums is boring for me, apart from EMDM which I don't think I'll ever enjoy.
    Albeit inadvertently, you make a decent point.

    Manson fans hated Antichrist Superstar because it wasn't Portrait of an American Family. Then they hated Mechanical Animals because it was too faggy, pop, and a sell-out. Then they hated Holy Wood because it was too dark again. Then they hated The Golden Age of Grotesque because it was too fun/heavy/pop/whatever, take your goddamned pick.

    And then it was ONOES MANSON HAZ EMO AND SOLOS WTF.

    The point is, Manson albums are always emo with solos just as much as any given album was also cartoonish, steeped in Americana, and faggy, dark, heavy, pop, a sell-out, etc. Just like all the others.

    Once people outgrow their their personal issues and start to simply appreciate Manson for being Manson, all of that quickly becomes self-evident. If you actually like Manson for who he is then you'll see its all there in every album and discover that you're really just tripping over your own bias if you're keeping yourself from seeing that.

    You're either a fan of Manson who enjoys his artistry and self-expression no matter its avenue or else your just some kind of genre enthusiast who Manson happened to meet halfway at some point somewhere along the path of his career.

    It really explains a lot if you think of it like that.

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  3. #32
    Married to Suedehead Shangri-LIE's Avatar
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    No.

    Here's why.

    It wasn't music and they weren't a band.
    OMNOMNOMNOMNOMNOMNOM


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  5. #33
    I've whited out my name. Halo Infinity's Avatar
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    @Shangri-LIE - The Golden Age of Grotesque was not an option in this question. Then again, even that apparently didn't come from music or a band either. =P

    On the other hand, and on a serious note, I was actually interested to see which one you'd pick over the other should you make a real choice between the two. Although, what you said could also count as neither or both too.

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  7. #34
    Married to Suedehead Shangri-LIE's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Halo Infinity View Post
    @Shangri-LIE - The Golden Age of Grotesque was not an option in this question. Then again, even that apparently didn't come from music or a band either. =P

    On the other hand, and on a serious note, I was actually interested to see which one you'd pick over the other should you make a real choice between the two. Although, what you said could also count as neither or both too.
    I don't give hints anymore, Halo. Fine. I enjoyed The Pale Emperor more even though I experienced more of what Born Villain conceptualized, which was sheer chaos. Not to be confused with mayhem. Seeking approbation through feigned psychopathy for "No Reason".
    Last edited by Shangri-LIE; 08-29-2017 at 10:45 AM.
    OMNOMNOMNOMNOMNOMNOM


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  9. #35
    NightChameleons's Avatar
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    This conversation is interesting to me. I have mixed feelings about both albums. I appreciate TPE for its musical quality and production values, which exceed any recent MM release in my opinion, and there are a few songs on it I play regularly. But, for some reason, it just doesn't "do it" for me in the sense that it doesn't really make feel anything and I can't discern what the album is really about in terms of an overarching theme. It's a beautiful record on the one hand, Manson's vocals are top notch, yet it leaves me wanting something more.

    Born Villain, on the other hand, holds a special place in my life, despite being an endearing mess production-wise. Like others have shared, I was on my own personal journey through romance and other life issues, and felt there was much on THEOL and EMDM that I related to around 2010-2011. For me, "Born Villain" was the triumphant come back not of MM's musical career, but of himself as a person - the phoenix reborn, cocky even, pea cocking as he stepped away from the ashes of romantic tragedy. After going through a hard break up, that album pretty much saved my life and helped me find my own confidence and "attitude" at a time when I was feeling very low. I devoured it, and the title song became my theme song for 2012, something I listened to almost daily. "I'm born villain; don't pretend to be a victim." It was also a sloppy, fun, "don't give a fuck" kind of year in my life, with some of the best memories ever and lots of misadventures that I look back on and think "I should have been in jail after that." I love all of MM's work, some more than others, but BV was the first and only MM album that I truly lived during its era, as cheesy as that may seen.

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  11. #36

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    I feel like TPE has better songs, but I'm less likely to listen to the album all of the way through. When I put on anything from Born Villain, I typically end up listening to the rest of the album all the way through.

    I want to say that the songs on TPE are tighter and more polished in a designed for radio/movie kind of way. That isn't a criticism. In fact, I think throughout Manson's whole career most of his songs have fallen more or less into 2 categories - Moody/experimental/dark and Anthemic/sarcastic/heavy - and TPE is the first time really that the songs have successfully blended both throughout.

    But to be honest, TPE is also the Manson album that I've most quickly burned out on. (A rare thing at that)

    Both are great albums but I suppose there is still something more "holistic" about Born Villain that I guess I get into a little more.

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  13. #37
    benis Mok's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by NightChameleons View Post
    Born Villain, on the other hand, holds a special place in my life, despite being an endearing mess production-wise. Like others have shared, I was on my own personal journey through romance and other life issues, and felt there was much on THEOL and EMDM that I related to around 2010-2011. For me, "Born Villain" was the triumphant come back not of MM's musical career, but of himself as a person - the phoenix reborn, cocky even, pea cocking as he stepped away from the ashes of romantic tragedy. After going through a hard break up, that album pretty much saved my life and helped me find my own confidence and "attitude" at a time when I was feeling very low. I devoured it, and the title song became my theme song for 2012, something I listened to almost daily. "I'm born villain; don't pretend to be a victim." It was also a sloppy, fun, "don't give a fuck" kind of year in my life, with some of the best memories ever and lots of misadventures that I look back on and think "I should have been in jail after that." I love all of MM's work, some more than others, but BV was the first and only MM album that I truly lived during its era, as cheesy as that may seen.
    I feel the same way, only except about The Pale Emperor. In late 2014 to mid 2015 I slipped back into a bad state of mind and that album just happened to coincide with it. I can remember specifically listening to "Warship My Wreck" and having to talk myself down of just driving headfirst into an oncoming pole. Never forgot that, and I associate that moment with the song itself. Sorry if any of that is cheesy or cringey, but eh, it happened and it's the truth. To me, TPE was the return to form that BV promised to be.

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  15. #38
    HEAVEN UPSIDE DOWN Hazekiah's Avatar
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    Dipp Six = The Pole Emperor

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  17. #39
    GAFSTER FuckmanQ's Avatar
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    god dammit.
    A system organized around the weakest qualities of individuals will produce these same qualities in its leaders.

  18. #40
    XIII arkahno's Avatar
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    I did, and I do.
    TPE has a flawless production and it has one of my fav mm songs ever (third day of asdb) but it just doesn't has "that thing" as an album, I don't have that feeling that other mm albums give me, that I want to repeat the entire thing again and again.
    In the other hand, BV, even with its amateur production feeling (which I love btw), feels more like an album, with different sensations and colors through all the album, and is a perfect mix of hit songs and weird songs, also it feels more like an album to me, the only thing I really, really, really dislike about BV is its coverart, which is ugly, plain, and failed to show the true soul of the album, also the desing and visual aspect of it it wasn't good at all.
    I love both, but in terms of an album, I really enjoy a lot more BV over TPE any time.
    Last edited by arkahno; 09-01-2017 at 10:56 AM.

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