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Thread: Release date extravaganza

  1. #1
    The Overman's Avatar
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    Default Release date extravaganza

    Because I have a lot of time to kill. And, now, also carpal tunnel.

    Including only studio album releases, and accounting only for the official U.S. release dates:


    Portrait Of An American Family -> Antichrist Superstar: 812 days [July 19, 1994-October 8, 1996]

    Antichrist Superstar -> Mechanical Animals: 707 days [October 8, 1996-September 15, 1998] <- Shortest wait

    Mechanical Animals -> Holy Wood (In The Shadow Of The Valley Of Death): 791 days [September 15. 1998-November 14, 2000]

    Holy Wood (In The Shadow Of The Valley Of Death) -> The Golden Age Of Grotesque: 910 days [November 14, 2000-May 13, 2003]

    The Golden Age Of Grotesque -> Eat Me, Drink Me: 1,484 days [May 13, 2003-June 5, 2007] <- Longest wait

    Eat Me, Drink Me -> The High End Of Low: 721 days [June 5, 2007-May 26, 2009]

    The High End Of Low -> Born Villain: 1,071 days [May 26, 2009-May 1, 2012]

    Born Villain -> The Pale Emperor: 994 days [May 1, 2012-January 20, 2015]

    The Pale Emperor -> Heaven Upside Down: 990 days [January 20, 2015-October 6, 2017]

    It's been a shorter wait for Heaven Upside Down than it was for Eat Me, Drink Me, Born Villain or, barely, The Pale Emperor.

    Oh, yeah: it'll have been 8,482 days between the release of Portrait Of An American Family and Heaven Upside Down.

    The discography ranked by wait time, shortest to longest, and treating Portrait as a non-entity:

    Mechanical Animals
    The High End Of Low
    Holy Wood (In The Shadow Of The Valley Of Death)
    Antichrist Superstar
    The Golden Age Of Grotesque
    Heaven Upside Down
    The Pale Emperor
    Born Villain
    Eat Me, Drink Me


    The mean release time is 848 days. The median release time is 910 days. The modal release time is ~990 days. The range, shortest wait from longest, is 741 days - the wait time between The Golden Age Of Grotesque and Eat Me, Drink Me was more than double the wait time between Antichrist Superstar and Mechanical Animals.
    Last edited by The Overman; 09-21-2017 at 02:39 PM.
    To revenge the misdeeds of the ruling class, there existed in the middle ages, in Germany, a secret tribunal, called the “Vehmgericht.” If a red cross was seen marked on a house, people knew that its owner was doomed by the “Vehm.”

    All the houses of Europe are now marked with the mysterious red cross.

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  3. #2

    Join Date: 09.19.17
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    I lot of publications and google.com results are stating the release date as September 29, 2017. It's strange because I can't find a solid source, but there are some decently reputable sources declaring this information. And from what I can surmise, the majority of the places that state this date started doing so within the last day or so. Has this been discussed elsewhere here?

  4. #3
    HEAVEN UPSIDE DOWN Hazekiah's Avatar
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    In the early days, I was used to an average of two years or so between every album -- supplemented by E.P.s, home video releases, and extended tours in between -- until the EXTREME wait between The Golden Age of Grotesque and Eat Me, Drink Me. Between that and the constant chatter from Manson about retiring from music altogether in between, I think that pretty much explains why I kinda went apeshit and happily, enthusiastically roadtripped at GREAT expense to catch almost ALL of the domestic shows on the Rape of the World Tour in 2007, lol.

    Not to mention a goodly portion of the '08 and '09 runs, too. Still making up for lost time!

    Hell, for that matter, same goes for the delay leading up to Born Villain.

    Annnd same goes for the wait for The Pale Emperor.

    I couldn't fucking take it otherwise. Getting a new album and seeing Manson a few times every couple years was essentially all that kept me going through the first DECADE of his mainstream career. And it hasn't gotten any easier since. After missing out for most of last year's run I'm REALLLLLY looking forward to hopping back in the saddle again, to say the least.

    Anyone else notice a distinct uptick in the anticipation and shows attended in correlation with the length of time between albums?

    Obviously, other factors are present but I think the overwhelming NEED FOR MORE after prolonged yearning is clearly a thing.

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  6. #4
    The Overman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hazekiah View Post
    Anyone else notice a distinct uptick in the anticipation and shows attended in correlation with the length of time between albums?

    Obviously, other factors are present but I think the overwhelming NEED FOR MORE after prolonged yearning is clearly a thing.
    What I find interesting is what the wait times tell us about each individual album.

    That between Antichrist Superstar and Mechanical Animals was 707 days - just a little under two years. And there was Remix and Repent between the two albums, not to mention all the public appearances that went with being an ascending rock star. Meanwhile, the stylistic transition between ACSS and MA is one of the most radical in the discography. That it took so little time strongly suggests to me that this was something Manson had in mind for a long time, probably since before ACSS. Which we know is probably true, given his references to wanting to make a "dark pop album" in the autobiography.

    Likewise, the wait between Mechanical Animals and Holy Wood was still shorter than that between Portrait and Antichrist, despite the Columbine shooting potentially throwing whatever plans the band had before that point into disarray and the level of thought that went into the making of Holy Wood. Again, to my mind this suggests that something was in the works along the broadly similar lines eventually realized by Holy Wood anyway - the "Coma White" video is suggestive of it - though how that might've played out is open to question.

    There has been some question lately whether or not there really was a different "Celebritarian album" planned after The Golden Age Of Grotesque, but that huge period of time - over four years - leads me to believe that the common story is probably true. Of course, Lest We Forget and Against All Gods accounts for some of that time.

    Some people have insinuated that The High End Of Low consists mainly of B-sides that were written before Twiggy rejoined the band. We know there are some of these on that record, but as little as I like it, the fact that the waiting period for THEOL was only the second-shorted in the band's history suggests otherwise. If you were set to release a record consisting predominantly of pre-written material, I think you might be able to get it done inside a year and a half.

    And I find it interesting that the last two albums have only a four-day difference in the period between their releases. I would think this is a function of Tyler Bates being a real professional musician. It's like clockwork.

    I'm also amused that the time difference between TGAOG and EMDM is only sixteen days - fifteen, if you don't count the release date proper - from being 1,500 days.
    To revenge the misdeeds of the ruling class, there existed in the middle ages, in Germany, a secret tribunal, called the “Vehmgericht.” If a red cross was seen marked on a house, people knew that its owner was doomed by the “Vehm.”

    All the houses of Europe are now marked with the mysterious red cross.

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  8. #5
    JoyfulDarter's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tetragrammaton View Post
    I lot of publications and google.com results are stating the release date as September 29, 2017. It's strange because I can't find a solid source, but there are some decently reputable sources declaring this information. And from what I can surmise, the majority of the places that state this date started doing so within the last day or so. Has this been discussed elsewhere here?
    I pre-ordered the album from Amazon and it says October 6th. I'm from the US.



    But it says "expected". I was pretty drunk when I initially did the pre-order, but I seem to remember it said a different date too. So who the fuck knows.

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  10. #6
    HEAVEN UPSIDE DOWN Hazekiah's Avatar
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    Well, Tyler Bates is also busy as hell with bigger projects to consider in terms of scheduling, so the need to squeeze in as much productive recording and touring time with Manson during their limited, shared availability is clearly an undeniable factor there, in addition to the "honeymoon period" of fresh inspiration that comes along with a new collaborator.

    As for The High End of Low, the origins of "Four Rusted Horses" and "Arma-Goddamn-Motherfuckin-Geddon" in particular speak to and reinforce the point that at least some of the material had already been mostly composed before Twiggy even rejoined the band...but I think it would be a mistake to consider the album as a whole as being merely a collection of aged b-sides, given Manson's & Twiggy's history of extreme productivity together and the fact that they were obviously excited to be collaborating again.

    Similarly, I find assumptions regarding the alleged "Celebritarian album" to be just that. Celebritarianism itself was a concept with which Manson was experimenting by name since at least as early as 2000 (a fairly telling date in terms of defining the concept itself, btw) and which was subsequently channeled into a personal art gallery and a loose conglomeration of fellow artists. I've never really seen much to suggest a whole album devoted to that theme was planned during that time aside from a light sprinkling of the general idea across most releases since then, not to mention basically all of the albums he'd written beforehand essentially undercutting the notion of it being intended as the focus for any given, specific album. Although, I'd love to be proven wrong! But it always seemed to me to be more of a case of Manson talking about the idea in general during a hiatus from recording and fans running wild with it in the absence of much else to talk about at the time.

    And I constantly take flak for it when I discuss the point but I maintain that it is self-evident that The Triptych was largely mapped out and pre-planned at least as early as 1996 rather than fabricated along the way.

    But that's a separate discussion I'll address later.

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  12. #7
    The Overman's Avatar
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    As an aside, I wonder why Born Villain took so long? I happen to like the record quite a lot, warts and all, but nothing about it suggests that it warranted a delay of two years, eleven months. There was some talk about Co-Morbid in that time and we all took it as a joke, but.... well, it seems plausible to me there might be a scrapped project in there, too. It's the second-longest delay in the discography, and unlike the period between Golden Age and Eat Me, Drink Me it would seem completely unwarranted [no divorce, no Best Of tour, etc.].
    To revenge the misdeeds of the ruling class, there existed in the middle ages, in Germany, a secret tribunal, called the “Vehmgericht.” If a red cross was seen marked on a house, people knew that its owner was doomed by the “Vehm.”

    All the houses of Europe are now marked with the mysterious red cross.

  13. #8
    HEAVEN UPSIDE DOWN Hazekiah's Avatar
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    On the contrary, I think it's important to factor in the touring there.

    Manson put out Eat Me, Drink Me, toured all over for about a year, and then cranked out The High End of Low pretty fast right after all that, to the point that he was touring again about a year after the previous tour wrapped up.

    That alone warrants some extra downtime.

    But I'm not sure that's even the case. Co-Morbid was likely an early working title like, say (say), SAY10...which is to say that project likely became Born Villain as it developed. And Manson himself mentioned having enough bonus content for an extended, deluxe edition which, unfortunately, hasn't yet come to be. So they were certainly keeping busy, regardless.

    And given that the tour for The High End of Low wrapped up JUST before NYE on 2010, that really just leaves the standard two year gap for recording Born Villain and pushing along with whatever else was in the works once he finally settled in back home long enough to catch his breath.

    Hell, he was even touring overseas for MONTHS before Born Villain even came out, shrinking the gap even further.

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    Thankfully fans love longer gaps between albums because they prefer supporting bands they listen to by attending shows and buying merchandise, right? I mean who would actually want to pay for CDs by the same band every year or two like in the old days.

  16. #10
    The Overman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by SangreV View Post
    Thankfully fans love longer gaps between albums because they prefer supporting bands they listen to by attending shows and buying merchandise, right? I mean who would actually want to pay for CDs by the same band every year or two like in the old days.
    That doesn't seem to really factor into anything Manson does, tbh. IIRC, Born Villain didn't leak [and is the only of his reccent albums not to leak].
    To revenge the misdeeds of the ruling class, there existed in the middle ages, in Germany, a secret tribunal, called the “Vehmgericht.” If a red cross was seen marked on a house, people knew that its owner was doomed by the “Vehm.”

    All the houses of Europe are now marked with the mysterious red cross.

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